This interview, by Steve Croft, was originally broadcast on CBS 60 Minutes, July 6, 2008
The name Douglas Feith may not mean much to you, but to students of the Iraq War and historians already studying it, he's one of the main architects. From 2001 to 2005, Feith was undersecretary of defense for policy and the number three man at the Pentagon, intimately involved with both pre-war strategy and post-war planning. His boss, Donald Rumsfeld, called Feith one of the most brilliant individuals in government, but he's also been a lightning rod for criticism and a magnet for blame. In his memoir, which has been called the first insider account of decision-making in Iraq, Feith defends much and apologizes for very little. But as we first reported back in April, he offers some unusual insights about the path to war.
Explain to me, because many Americans still don't understand it. Why did we invade Iraq?
Mr. DOUG FEITH: The president decided that the threats from the Saddam Hussein regime were so great that, if we had left him in power, we would be fighting him down the road at a time and place of his choosing.
(Footage of Douglas Feith walking to podium; Feith talking; photo of Feith with President George Bush)
KROFT: (Voiceover) If Douglas Feith doesn't look or sound much like a warrior, that's because he isn't. He's an intellectual, a hawkish neo-conservative defense policy wonk who occupied one of the top rungs in the Pentagon ladder, playing a key role in shaping the military's response to 9/11 and the decision to go to war with Saddam Hussein. Why was the decision made to go after him after 9/11? Because we knew even then that he didn't have anything do with it.
Mr. FEITH: What we did after 9/11 was look broadly at the international terrorist network from which the next attack on the United States might come, and we did not focus narrowly only on the people who were specifically responsible for 9/11. Our main goal was preventing the next attack.
KROFT: So you're saying you didn't think it was that important to go after the people who were responsible for it, more important to go after people who weren't responsible for it?
Mr. FEITH: No, I think it was important to go after the people who were responsible for 9/11. But it was also important to disrupt the international terrorist network and prevent whatever plans there were for follow-on attacks.
KROFT: Using those standards, you could have invaded North Korea, you could have invaded Syria, you could have invaded Iran.
Mr. FEITH: Well, you make a good point, but Iraq was a particular--was a special case in large part because of Saddam's record.
(Footage of oil fires; tank; military parade; Saddam Hussein saluting; dead Kurds; Feith during interview)
KROFT: (Voiceover) Feith says Saddam had already attacked Kuwait, Iran, Israel and Saudi Arabia; that he had defied the UN, evaded economic sanctions, used weapons of mass destruction on his own people and had the know-how, if not the wherewithal, to build a nuclear weapon. Feith believes the US invasion was justifiable as an act of self-defense.
I think this is a term you use in the book: "Anticipatory self-defense."
Mr. FEITH: In an era where WMD can put countries in a position to do an enormous amount of harm, the old idea of having to wait until you actually see the country mobilizing for war doesn't make a lot of sense.
(Footage of Donald Rumsfeld giving speech; Colin Powell testifying)
KROFT: (Voiceover) The American public was led to believe that Saddam Hussein had large stockpiles of weapons of mass destruction and was prepared to use them.
General COLIN POWELL: (From file footage) I'm going to show you a small part of a chemical complex...
(Footage of satellite photo of compound)
KROFT: (Voiceover) ...which famously turned out not to be the case.
One of the reasons people were told we were going to war in Iraq was because an imminent attack with weapons of mass destruction was about to happen.
Mr. FEITH: I don't believe anybody in the US government said that.
KROFT: This is Donald Rumsfeld, "Iraq poses a serious and mounting threat to our country. No terrorist state..."
Mr. DONALD RUMSFELD: (From file footage) No terrorist state poses a greater or more immediate threat to the security of our people and the stability of the world than the regime of Saddam Hussein.
President GEORGE W. BUSH: (From file footage) The Iraqi regime is a threat to any American.
Vice President DICK CHENEY: (From file footage) There is no doubt that Saddam Hussein now has weapons of mass destruction. There is no doubt that he is amassing them to use against our friends, against our allies and against us.
Mr. FEITH: It is true that there was a serious error that the CIA made in saying that we would find WMD stockpiles, and it was a terrible mistake for the administration to have made those stockpiles in any way a part of the case for war. I don't think we needed to, and I think...
KROFT: You don't think we needed to?
Mr. FEITH: I don't think we needed to. And I...
KROFT: Wasn't that the whole linchpin for the war?
Mr. FEITH: I don't believe so.
(Footage of Feith during interview; military parade; soldiers opening door; missile heads)
KROFT: (Voiceover) Feith insists that Saddam still had WMD programs in place and the capability to resume production. He says even Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld conceded privately that the United States might not find any weapons of mass destruction on the ground, and he told the president so in a memo that outlined all of the things that could possibly go wrong.
Some call it the CYA memo.
Mr. FEITH: Well, I think that's a mischaracterization. I mean, it was very intense and very disturbing work to anticipate all the possible problems of a war.
(Footage of Feith during interview; Rumsfeld giving testimony; Bush greeting troops with Laura Bush; battle)
KROFT: (Voiceover) Feith called the document "The Parade of Horribles" and printed many of them in his book to refute the perception that Secretary Rumsfeld and President Bush launched the war without understanding the possible consequences.
"The United States could become so absorbed with its Iraq effort that we'd pay inadequate attention to other serious problems."
Mr. FEITH: Yes.
KROFT: "The war could cause more harm and entail greater costs than expected." Obviously, it has. That it would not go on for two to four years, but eight to 10 years.
Mr. FEITH: Right.
KROFT: "Terrorist networks could improve their recruiting and fundraising as a result of our being depicted as anti-Muslim.
(Feith nods head yes)
KROFT: "Iraq could experience ethnic strife among Kurds, Sunnis and Shia."
Mr. FEITH: Right.
KROFT: "It could damage our relationship with our allies and our reputation in the world community.
(Feith nods head yes)
KROFT: Did you think that maybe one or two of these might happen?
Mr. FEITH: One of the things that is reflected in this memo is Secretary Rumsfeld's deeply held view that it's foolish to try to predict the future.
KROFT: Well, as it turned out, he was pretty good at anticipating problems because virtually all of these things have happened.
Mr. FEITH: Well, in a--in a broad sense. A lot of these things happened. It was a very honest effort to assess what the downsides of war would be.
KROFT: You still recommended that it was the right thing to do.
Mr. FEITH: We certainly understood that these are the things that might happen. That's why we wrote them down. And I--and I do think that, when the president assessed the risks of leaving Saddam in power, you could--you could also have come up with quite a serious, troubling list of the risks involved in leaving Saddam in power.
(Footage of "War and Decision" in assembly line; men firing guns; bomb exploding)
KROFT: (Voiceover) In his memoir "War and Decision," Feith writes that there was one potential problem the Pentagon seriously underestimated, to ability of Saddam's loyalists to create, carry out, and sustain a bloody resistance.
Mr. FEITH: Probably the main thing that we didn't anticipate was that from the grave, as it were, that regime would be able to operate the way it's operated in the insurgency.
(Footage of soldiers walking; soldiers running; soldiers in house; statue of Hussein being torn down)
KROFT: (Voiceover) The result was a lack of detailed contingency planning and a shortage of troops. Feith concedes that he and his colleagues didn't realize that sending a smaller, mobile force to topple Saddam would make it difficult to establish order after he fell.
(Footage of people looting)
Mr. FEITH: (Voiceover) The looting that arose in the immediate aftermath of the overthrow of Saddam was a problem that the coalition forces had to deal with.
KROFT: Didn't deal with.
(Footage of men looting)
Mr. FEITH: (Voiceover) Right. I think we paid a very large price for the fact that, you know, our forces did not get that problem under control.
KROFT: One of the things that you say was that we didn't have the manpower or the resources to do it.
Mr. FEITH: I don't believe I raised the troop level issue in that connection. But, I mean, you'll tell me if I misremember my own book.
(Footage of Feith during interview)
KROFT: (Voiceover) We refreshed his memory.
This is what you said: "The small force strategy for major combat operations, while it saved American lives, limited the number of forces we had to deal with the looting."
Mr. FEITH: That's a fair point. Your point's correct.
(Footage of soldiers walking; Paul Bremer and others walking)
KROFT: (Voiceover) To make matters worse, two months after the invasion, the US-led provisional authority running Iraq made one of the most controversial and most criticized post-war decisions. Newly appointed ambassador Paul Bremer announced that the Iraqi army would be disbanded, turning 400,000 unemployed and armed men into the streets.
Mr. FEITH: The first time I heard the idea, it came from Ambassador Bremer when he was on his way to Baghdad.
KROFT: And you signed off on it?
Mr. FEITH: I didn't sign off one way or the other. I told him that he has to discuss it with Secretary Rumsfeld.
KROFT: And he did?
Mr. FEITH: He says that he did. I'm--I was not in on those conversations. I don't--I--and the...
KROFT: So did Secretary Rumsfeld sign off on it?
Mr. FEITH: I did not find in the record any piece of paper in which Secretary Rumsfeld signed off on it.
KROFT: You had never asked Secretary Rumsfeld?
Mr. FEITH: We've talked...
KROFT: That's the part I find hard to believe.
Mr. FEITH: Well, no, no. I mean...
KROFT: There are hundreds of decisions.
Mr. FEITH: We talked about--we talked about it late in the...
KROFT: This is--this is--I mean, this isn't one of hundreds of decisions. This is a decision to dissolve the Iraqi army.
Mr. FEITH: Well, the Iraqi army was, at that point, dissolved. This was the issue of do you reconstitute them or start from scratch with a new military?
KROFT: Well, you're raising doubts about whether there was approval. That's why I'm doing this.
Mr. FEITH: No, no, what I'm--what I'm saying is the process by which this decision was made was not a great process.
(Footage of Feith and Kroft walking and talking; Feith meeting with others; Ahmed Chalabi talking)
KROFT: (Voiceover) Feith, who taught the past two years at Georgetown University, intimates in his book that none of this might have happened if the administration had stuck with his plan for post-war Iraq, which involved quickly ceding some authority and responsibility to a group of Iraqi exiles and Kurds, which included Ahmed Chalabi.
Mr. FEITH: We developed plans to try to give meaning to the concept of liberation rather than occupation, and one of--one of my great regrets is that the United States wound up setting up an occupation government in Iraq for 14 months, which I think was a--was a serious mistake.
(Footage of Feith during interview; George Tenet talking to Powell, Tommy Franks walking with others)
KROFT: (Voiceover) Feith says there had been lots of errors in judgment, but not by him. He is generous in his criticism of Secretary of State Colin Powell, CIA Director George Tenet and General Tommy Franks. And they have returned the favor plus interest.
General Franks, I don't have to tell you what he said, but he called you...
Mr. FEITH: It was not nice.
KROFT: It was not nice. Basically, the dumbest guy on the face of the planet. Former CIA Director George Tenet called your intelligence evaluations total crap. This isn't normal Washington discourse.
Mr. FEITH: I agree. And some people, when they deal with controversy, political issues, use harsh language. I don't think it's a great thing.
KROFT: This is a lot of vitriol directed at you. They don't use it in general, they directed it at you. Why you think that is?
Mr. FEITH: You'd have to ask them.
(Footage of Feith and Kroft walking and talking; Feith working at his desk; photo of Bush with Feith; photo of Mohammed Atta; Prague street; report)
KROFT: (Voiceover) Some of them have already answered that question in books of their own or with quotes in the books of others, portraying Feith as a bureaucratic bully hell bent on war. The most frequent and damaging charge has been that Feith used his Pentagon office to produce alternative intelligence reports that linked Saddam to al-Qaeda and passed them on to the White House. Some of it, like the report that 9/11 hijacker Mohammed Atta met with Iraqi intelligence in Prague, has been widely discredited. An investigation by the Pentagon's inspector general called Feith's activities inappropriate but not illegal or unauthorized.
This was a rebuke. Do you agree?
Mr. FEITH: Yes, I--and I think it was an unfounded rebuke, an ill-founded rebuke.
KROFT: Are you happy with the way things have played out in Iraq?
Mr. FEITH: No, I don't think anybody can be happy. We've had terrible losses. We have the Americans who have lost their lives and Iraqis who've lost their lives, our coalition partners. It's been, you know, a costly war.
KROFT: Do you still think this was the right thing to do, knowing now what you know?
Mr. FEITH: I think the president made the right decision, given what he knew and given what we all knew. And to tell you the truth, even given what we've learned since.
KROFT: In his memoir, Feith doesn't dwell on the terrible human cost of the war, but he clearly has been moved by them. He's donated all his proceeds from the book to a foundation he's created to benefit veterans and their families.